Igbo in Buhari’s administration have failed South-East – Moghalu, APC chieftain

An All Progressives Congress (APC) governorship aspirant in Anambra State, George Moghalu, has vowed to continue with his suit challenging the alleged injustice done to him during the party’s primary. He also highlighted several issues in this chat with David Lawani

You contested primary and ‘chickened out’ in Anambra State. Can you bring Nigerians up to speed on the issues? What is happening in your case?
Let me for this is an opportunity. And to be honest with you, I refused to speak on this Anambra politics because the lawyers say when the issue is in the court, you don’t speak. It is a sub judice. But, to that extent, let me tell you that I am in court. And following the judicial process, so, we are in court to follow up on the matter.

Are you not bothered about the party; that they are compiling the names of the people who take the party to court?
Why should I be worried? My being in court is not a hidden agenda. It is as public as anything. If they compile my name, so be it. I wish them the best of luck.

Has the party reached out to you to step down?
No, the party has not reached out to me.

And the presidency?
Yes. I have met with the vice president and leaders in their capacity. But the issue is private. They are not what I am supposed to be discussing in the media. I think we are personalising the issue. We are making it look like, it is just me. It is not about me, but about the democratic institution. It is about doing what is right. It is about halting impunity. It is about the interest of the party in the state. It is about APC and democracy.

So, it is not about George Moghalu. It should not be reduced to George Moghalu wanting to be governor. I keep saying that power belongs to God. He gives it to whomever He pleases, and at His own time. And God’s will must be done. If God says it is my destiny that I will be governor, I will be. If God says no, I will not be. So, these are things that are beyond us. It is not about me. Yes, he has visited me. And so, what?

With this, don’t you think the party might feel you are pursuing an anti-party ambition?
Well, I wish them luck. Everybody is free to think whatever they feel. I am seeking justice. And not only me, but for the entire APC, so that things can be done properly. So that we can enthrone decency and democratic norms. It is as simple as that. It is not about me.

The allegations against you are that you are not following the internal mechanism of resolving intra-party issues.
What is an inter-party mechanism? You have set up an appeal committee, and I have appeared before it. What do they want?

Have you heard from the APC?
I have not heard from them. Even as we speak, I didn’t get their report. I applied, but I did not get it. And don’t forget I have a timeframe within which if I don’t take my protest to court, I am out. So, it could be a ploy to get me to lose that opportunity.

Is there anything that can make you withdraw the case in court?
I think you are kind of prompting nature in this instance. Because what you are doing is to talk about morals when we are still living in today. Let us wait for tomorrow to come and we will deal with it. But the truth about it is that, as we speak, George Moghalu is in court in Abuja.

What it means is that if Mr. President or the vice president calls you now, you won’t bother?
That is why I said they are trying to look at tomorrow when we are still living today. Let us deal with today and wait for tomorrow to come.

How strong are the chances of your party in the state?
Anything I say certainly will be misunderstood and misconstrued. You must look at it from that perspective and give me the benefit of doubt. Because I am not in a good position now to analyse the party’s position. Because anything I say may be a reality or maybe misconstrued that somebody is not with the party. And these are some of the challenges. You have to excuse me now because I am not in a good position to give an understandable situation report on the status of the party. Because some might see it as true, and some might not, depending on which side of the divide you are standing on.

That you are in court doesn’t mean you have abandoned APC?
I am an APC man. How can I abandon the party?

How much of the party’s activities are you following as a national officer? There were lots of crises in the congresses, and so many things are happening.
I am worried like a lot of people are. I am a critical stakeholder. And I make bold to say it. Because I have laboured for the party. I played a role in the formation of the party. I have a stake. I am watching, because for now, it has been reduced to an Anambra issue. It is a fight for Anambra. Don’t forget that I was a member of the merger committee that formed the party. I was elected the first national auditor of the party and re-elected. And, before the president graciously appointed me into this position that made me leave the party leadership. So, I have been fully involved in the party and the process. I am worried about what I read in the papers on the reactions. So, my appeal is that we should not allow this party to implode.

What is your build-up to 2023?
I am worried because we are now playing God. Everybody is now talking about 2023, and we are still in 2021. Who discusses with God to give a guarantee that he is going to be alive? What is the guarantee? Why don’t we make use of the best opportunity that we have? Why don’t we do the best now for the people? Let us emphasise and limit ourselves to today in 2021. Why are we talking about 2023? Why the emphasis? And why the worry?

You are a politician…
I have no problem with anybody having an ambition for 2023. But my appeal is that we should lay emphasis more on delivering the dividends of democracy now because we need to have a country that we aspire to lead in 2023. So, we need to build that political culture and get the people to understand and appreciate our challenge, which is part of what we are doing.

Building the democratic culture and encouraging our people. And, by the time we get to 2023, these problems will be resolved. God has a role to play in this business. But we keep removing God from the scheme. It is only a living man who can aspire to positions. And only a healthy man can aspire to be anything. We have seen it happen before. It is not rocket science. We have seen people who have tried to plan what they are going to do next year, and they did not live to see next year. It has happened before. So, why don’t we do our best now to justify the confidence the people have in us?

And that is what worries me. You see, in a political setting and a party, the only time you have challenges is when you want to cut corners. The rules are straightforward, and if you follow the straight line, you won’t run into problems. But the moment you try to manipulate the process, you will get the answer you deserve. That is why we are having challenges and hiccups right, left, and centre.

Is the process wrong?
It is not right. How can it be right, and we are having challenges across the states? And we are having disagreements? If you provide a guideline, allow it to operate to the fullest, and not minding whose ox is gored. You cannot bend the rules.

The zoning arrangement is tearing the party apart. What is your advice on this issue?
We must talk about it. Honestly, we must put the issue on the table and discuss it. We are talking of human beings. And we are talking of interest. All this clashing left, right, and centre is just about interests. We are dealing with human beings, not robots.

So, we must come to the discussion table. The party as a platform should play the leadership role now by creating the enabling environment for peace to reign. No matter how bad the situation is, we must discuss it. Check the history; every war has always ended at the discussion table, and not at the battle line. And the question I keep asking is that; why do we have to get to war first before we negotiate? Why don’t we negotiate, discuss and settle, to avoid that war?

Do we have to come back after the destruction had taken place? And that is what baffles me as a leader. All of us are leaders in our various groups. It baffles me. Why do we have to quarrel before we discuss? Why don’t we discuss to avoid that quarrel? Because we are still going to discuss after or before the quarrel. So, to avoid the quarrel, we discuss first. We must talk about it. No matter how difficult it is, we must talk about it. Because if you keep postponing the day, a time will come there will not be a need again for postponement.

What is your take on the agitations that power must come to the South in 2023?
It is a political decision. And they are entitled to it.

Don’t you think such a statement is inflammatory?
It depends on your perspective on it. And where you are looking at it from.

And the north is born to rule?
It is not about being born to rule. We have heard that before. It still gets back to the point that we have to discuss it because it is people that will do the planning and the voting. It is the people that will lead.

What is your assessment of the Buhari government?
The truth I have always said is that, whenever you want to assess a regime, don’t take it from the middle. Take it from the beginning. Look at it from the perspective of promises made and promises delivered. Using empirical evidence, I come from the Southeast.

The promises made to us are being delivered one after the other. And let me also emphasise so strongly, that Nigeria as a nation is a work-in-progress. We have not reached our destination, our desired destination. But everybody is working to achieve that destination, barring all the challenges. There are projects that you can mention, legacy projects. For me, if he has one legacy project, I will credit this administration. It is a fact that the Second Niger Bridge is almost coming to completion. We were in this country between 1999 and 2015, there were four flagging off for that same bridge.

Before every election, you have the national flag off. The president comes to Onitsha, and they put canopies to flag off. And the president goes. We pack away the canopies and the projects. Until Buhari came and made a commitment and started delivering. I throw a challenge that we the elite of Southeast are sitting on the centre table. Let me remind you, in case you have forgotten, as at the time under reference that the Secretary to the Government of the Federation (SGF) was from the Southeast. The Minister of Finance and Economic Affairs was from the Southeast. The Chairman, House Committee on Works was from the Southeast. The Chairman, Senate Committee on Works was from the Southeast. The Deputy Senate President was from the Southeast; Deputy Speaker was from the Southeast.

And no one kilometre of the road was tarred. And I dare to challenge anyone, for 16 years that they were there, what were the legacies? I even forgot to mention the Minister of Aviation; she was from the Southeast. They are all from the Southeast. The same table where decisions were made, when we would have put it in the budget and it would have been approved, financed, and awarded? All from Southeast! But today, work is going on the federal roads in the southeast. Enugu-Onitsha is under construction. Enugu-Port Harcourt is near completion. Aba-Ikot-Epene, Umahia-Ikot-Epene is under construction. These are critical and major roads in the Southeast.

Why is your party owing some members and still going after them?
Instead of the party going after them, why not pay them? Supposing they are the ones owing to the party?

You have offered somebody your ticket…
Who did I offer?

One of the people you demonise
It is a problem. We have a problem. You don’t offer a ticket. It is not sold like a biscuit in the market. It is the people who will decide who will have their ticket. Getting a ticket is making you one among them. It is like a case of the party members agreeing to say, give Romanus this ticket so that we can follow him on the election. What that means is that we are putting our destiny, as in we agreed to put our destiny under the care of Romanus, and we will work as a team to deliver him.

How do you deliver? It is by voting, campaigning, and ensuring that your votes count. But you sit back in Abuja and decide that it is Okeke in Niger-Delta that will fly the ticket, without the input of those who owns the party, and those who own the party are the people. If you disrespect and disregard them, and you now bring an Okeke and impose him on them, then you will get the consequence.

The APC caretaker committee is like Buhari. There is a deep hatred for them. How will you assess them?
I will not assess them now because I have issues with them. it will not be fair to do that now. At the appropriate time, it will be done.

As an agency, what has NIWA (Nigerian Inland Waterways Authority (NIWA) been doing before now?
We are very worried, and we have done quite a lot to stem the tide. We have done a lot of sensitisation. We have introduced a protocol such that you cannot operate from 6pm in the night till 6am. The reason is simple. Statistics have shown that over 70 to 80 per cent of the accident happened in the night. And what that simply means is that we don’t have control at that time. So, we ban it. We confiscate, arrest and prosecute the boat operators who try to infringe on those protocols.

We have also retooled our training programme. Even as we speak now, there is an ongoing school we are developing in Warri. We are also cooperating with a private sector player. And they have set up a training school in Lagos to train boat operators. Not too long ago, I was in Badagry. I went to Badagry by water from Lagos for a closing ceremony of training we organised in partnership with an agency with over 450 boat operators in Badagry. So, we have increased so much on boat operations.

There is awareness on improving the protocol and the certification process. It is to make sure that vessels that operate in water are certified. But I am most saddened and disappointed that despite our efforts, our people have refused to obey this protocol. And we keep telling them, you cannot operate or enter a vessel without a safeguard. You must wear a lifebelt. And we distribute these safeguards to various outposts. The thing most of these people don’t understand is that some of their lifebelts have expired. We try to educate them. We bring in new ones, as part of our corporate social responsibility. We are even giving vessels. I was in Yawori to commission vessels.

I will be in Lagos again to commission the 13 vessels we have given for patrol. It is to make sure that our waters are open and clear. You also know that we have floating wrecks and water high seas. These are some of the challenges we are having. We have been repeatedly removing them, but these are not things you remove, and once it is gone, like if you finish removing water high risk, by next season, it will come back. You cannot say, oh, I have to remove wrecks in 2020, so there won’t be in 2021, because it will still come. Our maintenance attitude is also unfortunate.

The way we handle plastics and floating debris. They just gather this rubbish, check right and left, and dump it. And anytime they have an opportunity, they just throw it. Where it flows to is no longer their business. We have an attitudinal problem, and we must keep educating our people because it is a major challenge, and we are confronting it. Because the lives of Nigerians are very important, we believe that whatever we can do as an agency to enhance water transportation will be to the great benefit of Nigeria and Nigerians.

What is the number of people who have been prosecuted?
I may not know or give you the exact statistics now. If you ask me this question, I will call round. Because what we have done is to allow area offices and arrest vessels to take an on-the-spot decision. I have given that authority to my area manager. Get these people and arrest their vessels that are not seaworthy. You will see our people getting vessels thoroughly overloaded. Now, they know we are fighting them at our jetties. What you now see them do is that they go to our waterfront and put three rickety jetties.

Vessels that are designed to carry 20 persons will now carry 50, plus the load. By the time we get this information, we go after them. And most of the accidents that have happened are a result of the consequences of overloading the vessels, which is very sad.

You promised that those who violated the right of way will be prosecuted, or actions were taken against them. Any evidence so far?
We have done quite a lot. And we will continue. But the point is that for you to be on NIWA’s right of way, you must have been permitted. You must be certified. That is what the Act says. The right of way is clearly defined. It is not even anybody’s making. Once we find you encroaching on it without a permit, we will stop you there.

You promised that there will soon be vessels from Lagos to Onitsha port. What is the state now?
We are still on course. We are very on it. It may interest you to know that there is a concession session. At the same time, there is a license for companies that are going to move in with high vessels from Onitsha to Lagos. We are engaging the Nigeria Chamber of Commerce and the Legion. We have engaged exporters and importers associations, as well as different groups. We are on course. It is one of the things I am passionate about because I know the economic benefits. It is not sentimental.

My decision to focus on it and achieve is to improve activities on our waters. Two, it is to decongest our ports, and three, to remove the pressure we have placed on our roads. Our roads are not designed to carry the pressure they are carrying, and that is the truth. I am trying to present a simple analogy. If, for example, you are moving one million containers to the south, from Lagos, what that simply means is that you are going to put three million trailers on the roads. One million trailers to take one million containers. And another one million to bring the empty containers back to Lagos. So, if you can remove these containers from the roads and put them on water, why not? That is the driving force.

The Federal Government has spent a huge amount to dredge Baro port. What is the way out now?
Baro Port is one of the ports of responsibility of the government. It is a world-class port. But we have some challenging infrastructure that is by way of roads. But I am happy to announce that the Federal Government is taking it up. The Niger State government has shown very great interest and enthusiasm. And when that is done, I am sure activities will pick up.

There is a need to do the dredging. It is a capital-intensive one. The government did it in 2012, 2013, and 2014. So, what we now emphasise in NIWA is what I called maintenance dredging. In this situation, we can use our dredgers in-house. Making sure these channels are opened. I have said it repeatedly that we have over 10,000 kilometres of waterways. Only about 8,000 are navigable. My agenda is to use maintenance to ensure over 10,000 is the kilometres that are navigable so that we can put them to effective use. Once resources are made available, then we can increase the number.

How do we put the 10,000 kilometres in use?
It requires a lot of money. But I don’t think that is the emphasis. The emphasis now is the navigable ones. Let us put it into 100 per cent effective use. Let it be that we have so much used these channels, and we want to extend other openings. That should be the focus. The truth is that you can access 28 states in Nigeria by water.

What are the challenges you have battled these two years?
Life itself is a challenge. When I came into the office, I noticed that NIWA was under-reported. Nobody knew about it. Let me use these opportunities that I have with you to thank the media for their efforts. Our first meeting was in Lagos. When I came in, I needed to get a lot of staff, and we needed to change so many things, including the training of my staff, as well as knowing them for who they are so that they can deliver. This is because to whom much is given, much is expected. I try to address the issue of welfare and funding. I won’t tell you there was no challenge with funding.

It was a problem. So, it was not in our place to control it. But it is in our place to bear the brunt of any glut in the international market. In the solid minerals sector, you will agree with me that a lot has been happening in those sectors. So, finance has its challenge. Again, don’t forget there was a time oil was selling for $100m in this country. Unfortunately, we didn’t have enough savings.

Up to a point that it dropped to $26. The truth remains that we are a mono-economy before this administration came to be. Again, another thing was institutional conflicts. Apart from some agencies disagreeing with you in some areas, some state governors were clashing with us. But we are navigating those parts. And there is also a ministry challenge that we are also addressing. Everybody wants to remain with the Act setting up their agencies. And, in the course of it, clashes occur. But the institutional challenges are being addressed; we are trying our best to resolve them.

What have you done to ensure these 28 states, with different parties can work with you, without clashes?
The fact is that National Inland Water Ways is not APC. It is a national institution. It is neither APC nor PDP. Which means it is an organisation or authority under the Ministry of Transportation. For me as a politician, when it has to do with NIWA, I do my work.

There is no boundary about whether who of who is in APC or not. I relate well with the governors within the limit of my official responsibility. Why won’t I relate with you? We are talking of Inland waterways for Nigeria. We are not talking about parties. When it is time for the party, we will do the business, but when it has to do with the work, we will do it as it is provided in the book.

Would you access yourself in this agency for the two years as having done well?
It won’t be fair to start accessing myself. I will rather want posterity to judge me. What I will tell you is that, by the time we clock two years, we will release our official pamphlet to show what and what we have done. And what we met on the ground in our first year and second year. So, it is for posterity to judge. But for me to stand here and start telling you about myself, and what I have done, is not fair to me.

What are the statistics of those involved in piracy you have encountered?
I don’t have the statistics as to the attacks. But at the same time, it is in the realisation of this that made NIWA has its police. Because if there were no expectations of things like this, there would not have been needing for National Inland Waterways police.

And the support and encouragement we have received from the Navy, police, and armed forces are quite encouraging. Like you know, we are not from the moon. Our security challenge is not limited to the water alone. It is all over the place. A new effort is being made to see that we resolve the issues. I must appreciate and thank the agency. And I also appreciate the URIWA police.