A rights activist and lawyer, Dr Kayode Ajulo, who is an ardent supporter of Vice President Yemi Osinbajo for President in 2023, speaks about the forthcoming presidential election, the continued incarceration of the leader of the proscribed IPOB, Nnamdi Kanu in the face of granting of amnesty to repentant Boko Haram terrorists, among other issues, in this interview with BEN OGBEMUDIA

Just last week, the Senate rejected President Muhammadu Buhari’s request to amend the Electoral Act, did this come to you as a surprise?

An election may be tomorrow, you can even choose to resign today. Go there after all you know that there is no rope tying your leg from running, then after the congress or the convention, you can tell them to employ you back, so tell me which part of the constitution does that offend? Don’t forget that appointment is not a right, it is a privilege.

A privilege that has been conferred on you, you cannot claim it to be a right, if you cannot claim the right, all you need is not to abuse that privilege and that’s why the issue of the section that you cannot present yourself to be violated and then be shouting I have been injured, that is the position. And I think I must salute the National Assembly including the President for allowing separation of powers and checks and balances. I thank the President for speaking his mind as a citizen and President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria who is in the office by the mandate of the people and if you use the mandate of the people to express the view of the people, you allow another set of people with another mandate to also express their view and to determine what you are doing, so the president needs to be commended.

Those in the National Assembly also need to be saluted, that the President has said his mind, follow the order of process that says review this, they have also used the mandate that was given by the people of Nigeria to look into his request and rejected it.

This is democracy in action but I must say this is one of the provisions of the Electoral Act that we can say is very revolutionary that’ we must continue to safeguard because our problem in Nigeria today is lack of internal democracy and I need to tell you that perfect internal democracy is the beginning of the wisdom of good electoral process in Nigeria.

If we cannot get it right from the internal, are you the one to teach us when you cannot get democracy right in your cocoon, you now want to do it outside, I think we need to applaud both of them at least I am very grateful personally because immediately the President wrote that letter to the House, I forwarded my letter too for the reason why that section 84 /12 should not be reviewed and I am so happy I have been vindicated on that.

Will you say the President is leaving up to his promises in bequeathing a perfect democratic system?

I want to believe that by the step taken with this revolutionary electoral act that is just being signed into law particularly that section 84 has achieved something, it’s a step to getting our internal democracy right, and mind you, section 226 of our constitution gives the National Assembly power to make law, regulate and manage the party and to ensure internal democracy and if there is any law that will ensure internal democracy, it is section 84 /12. So, that is the beginning of the end, particularly when it comes to getting a credible, free, and fair election in Nigeria because without internal democracy, without primaries, you know there is what we call pre-pre- election, we have pre-election matter but this one is pre-election matter and if we can get our pre-election matter then pre-election is a forgotten thing before we get to the election.

You have been very vocal in your choice of Vice President Yemi Osinbajo as your presidential choice for 2023, why?

I am a private citizen to start with. I am a citizen of the Federal Republic of Nigeria and again I am a father and uncle to some people, I am a son to people and a brother. I belong to every fabric in this country professionally, culturally, and so on. If you have been following what I have been saying, I am one of those that believe we must get things right in this country and whatsoever in this, you can use to get a perfect community although it is difficult to get a perfect polity, but to get it to some point, it must start with leadership. Nigeria is so blessed with a lot of natural resources.

Our climate is perfect, Nigeria is a place where you will see the sun today and rain tomorrow. Nigeria is where the weather is so perfect everywhere, you will be surprised if we dig this ground the number of mineral resources we can get even on this mountain in Maitama. Nigeria is blessed, I have travelled all over the country, I have been to so many places in the world and the only problem in Nigeria is leadership.

If I should sit and be truly genuine with our agitations. If I see good leadership or a process where we so much sought we can be achieved, I think it will be right for me to lend my voice to it and I must say this, Nigeria is so blessed with great people but unfortunately when it comes to choosing leadership, only few. I am talking of a Nigeria where we have a Nobel laureate winner, a Nigeria where in the area of agric, science, and legal, you cannot push Nigeria away.

I am talking of a Nigeria where our Nigeria Police will leave this country to serve at the international arena and come home with awards. You will see Nigerian soldiers going on peacekeeping missions and coming home with laurels because Nigerians are great. However, when it comes to the process we always adopt in choosing our leaders, it is somehow faulty in such a way that the great people I have talked about, you hardly see them on the scene.

In the business world, if I ask you to mention Nigerians you can count up to 30 and also in the academic world but when it comes to people that will lead us, only charlatans will come out to be raising their hands and that is why you will see convicts, criminals, and 419ers being chief executives in this country and then we will be asking ourselves who did we offend. If one can identify someone based on experience, like I told someone, Shakespeare said it all although it is always attributed to Roosevelt that greatness can be achieved in three ways.

It is either you are born into greatness, you achieve greatness or you have greatness tossed upon you, and this person I mentioned seems to have the three boxes. He was born into greatness, he has achieved greatness because I know what it takes to be a professor of law not from any other university but the University of Lagos, I know what I’m talking about and I am a lawyer and I know what it takes for you to rise above the rank and attain the rank of Senior Advocate of Nigeria, that is greatness. Not only that, you will find that he is someone that greatness has been tossed upon not just today.

This is somebody that was the Special Adviser to the Federal Attorney- General of the Federation, he performed exceedingly well that the principal was even promoted and became the Honourable judge of the World Court in The Hague at least you know what that one is. During this current democratic dispensation, greatness was tossed upon him again. He was made the Attorney- General of Lagos State and the success of Lagos is known to all of us.

Not only that, the Vice-President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria was tossed upon him and I am yet to see anybody that can fault him in any of his steps so far and the little time he was allowed to administer this country, you know what everybody has been saying. So to me, for such a person, we can have a system propping that one to be the President of Nigeria, I believe we would have been able to achieve some milestone in good governance. That is the only reason.

But some are saying that he is being pushed against his benefactor. Do you think so too?

I don’t know what people call a benefactor. Let me tell you one thing, we are talking about governing Nigeria, we are talking of the President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria, it is not something that should be for sale. So, you mean if I give you money now you will start campaigning for me that I must be the next President of Nigeria because you are my benefactor, it should not be.

One way or the other we are beneficiaries or benefactors, I have been a benefactor to a lot of people and I have been a beneficiary of a lot of people even this man you mentioned that he is a benefactor, one way or the other, if you check my history he must have helped me. But the question here is this, is it because of that I will sell the Presidency?

We should look at over 200 million Nigerians that is what we should look at. Now that we are talking about the presidency of Nigeria, it should not be sacrificed under the altar of sentiments or whatsoever we think it should be. Nigeria should not be a compensation package, I think that should not be. It should even be uncharitable for him If he should consider that. It’s quite uncharitable to say that because one person has helped me and you have a better service to render to Nigeria but because of the plate of porridge and rice you give, I don’t think he should do that.

I believe he is more honourable to do such a thing, what matters most is who can do the job. Of course, Asiwaju Bola Tinubu is well respected, he is a leader of men, and he has been there before. In 2004 when I got married, two of my daughters were born and when the same man became the governor of Lagos State, I was in the University now my daughters are in university and you think it should be the same person?

There shouldn’t be any generational changes because of rice and beans that one benefactor has given to me? Let us assume, the last time this man ever tried anything on the issue of governance is now going to be over 15 to 16 years. Is that one in this age of technology the same person?

I know if you enter a plane today flying to Lagos and the pilot announces to you that ladies and gentlemen that 20 years ago, I flew this plane but don’t worry I bought food for the man that bought tickets for you and that is why they said I should fly you, I am sure you will all jump out and say we are not going again but for you to see somebody for the last seven years as a good pilot, flying to Lagos and flying back without any accident, will you suggest that they leave that one somewhere and bring this one that flew 20 years ago because he served us rice every day. We don’t need to experiment with failure again and that is why I am so passionate about it.

How do you want me to explain to my daughters that 20 years ago this same man was governor when I was in university and now that they are in university, this same man should come again and be the governor, and won’t they say Daddy are you okay? I am sure yours will ask you that so, this is not the issue of sentiments. Like I told you, if we are to talk about a benefactor, I am one of the beneficiaries but because Nigeria’s presidency is not for sale, I will not be part of it. It would have been better for him to continue to be the leader that he is and Asiwaju to continue to be the Asiwaju, for him to show us the way to groom people.

It would have been better for all of us to be his mentee and to continue to prop up leaders. Today, one of the greatest achievements that Ahmadu Bello, the Saudana of Sokoto is to identify leaders and how to prop up leaders. At the time his work was qualified more than anybody for him to be the President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria but it seemed like he understood politics more than other people and that is why he stayed in Kaduna and brought one of his mentees to Lagos and the power still resides in the North, That is the way it should be. When Awolowo tried what happened? You could see the way they were fighting.

There would always be benefactors and beneficiaries but the ability of benefactors to know when to say it is enough let me bring someone up is crucial. We all pray that our children will be more successful than us and I think that should be the prayer of Asiwaju this time around.

What is your reaction to the release of Sunday Igboho?

Well, as a lawyer, let’s start with the fact that I received the news of his release with excitement, with gladness, with happiness particularly being one of those that have been saying he must be released. You know there are different types of crimes and criminalities.

Some things are political prisoners. I classify Sunday Igboho as a political prisoner and Nnamdi Kanu and there is a way they should be treated. Mandela was sentenced to life imprisonment for fighting for the truth, but at the end of the day, he became the hero because all that he was after is the aspiration of the people that is the supreme price any leader can pay and I don’t see any reason to keep them, not only Sunday Igboho, he has been released conditionally and he needs to be released unconditionally including Nnamdi Kanu and all other freedom fighters in this country.

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They need to be released and if some people can be given amnesty, they should be given and I said this, even Boko Haram fighters including bandits that genuinely want to lay down their arms, I think the same treatment should be given to them, they should be given amnesty because when it comes to peace, no price is too big to achieve peace in this country and I think that is the way it should be because if truly you can contain them, you should have contained them before now.