Veteran technocrat and former Secretary to the State Government (SSG) in Katsina and old Kaduna State, Alhaji Isah Mohammed Katsina, spoke to Andy Asemota on the growing insecurity in the country, among other issues. Excerpts:

What should the President do to check insecurity and economic downturn? How did we get here?

There have been a lot of delay, one may say, in the six years of the present administration in dealing with crucial issues. Nigerians thought Buhari would solve their problems in two years, starting from the day he took his oath of office. Instead of doing so, he allowed those he met in office, those appointed by his predecessor to remain in office for six months without any positive change.

He never changed (them); in six months, nothing happened. We thought he was going to establish special courts, special commission or sort of, on emergency, and so on and so forth. He remained adamant doing nothing, working with people who didn’t love him for six months. That was the beginning of it all, and he continued. Even when he appointed ministers, he continued going slowly, and people were even called him Baba Go Slow. That was not the Buhari people knew. So, these things grew into what the Hausa refer to as allowing the lion’s cub to grow into an adult lion that is stronger than its owner. That is the literal meaning of what happened.

So, I am very sorry because a lot of damage had already been done and these are people who are thinking that everything is beyond Nigeria and that he should call for mercenaries to fight our war for us. With a population of 200 million Nigerians, we are talking of mercenaries and most of these 200 million people are able bodied young men between the ages of 20 to 50; not up to the age of retirement. When we are faced to national crisis like this one, I think the government should involve all Nigerians. It should have recruited young Nigerians who are roaming the streets and take them to the war front and deal with these people in the forests. I know these forests. I have been traversing them during peaceful and working days, and I know their boundaries. The government even knows them more than I do. It is not an impossible task for Nigerians to deal with the situation before it became widespread.

Why is it such an uphill task recruiting adequate number of Nigerian youths into the armed forces?

You think it is impossible?

Not all, but why is the government failing in that regard?

That is one of the things that baffles our imagination. Why should Buhari even contemplate engaging mercenaries with the huge number of able and willing Nigerians? He could even an emir to draft young Nigerians into the army.

Sir, recruitment into some security agencies is said to attract huge fee per candidate nowadays. It is not an issue of Nigerians’ reluctance to enlist into the security forces. What is your take on that?

You see, the government is not straight-forward, and people do not believe in what it is doing.

Recently, some senators called for a declaration of emergency on insecurity in the country, what is your reaction to that?

Is there any sincerity in that? My opinion is that there is no sincerity all in that kind of thing. The National Assembly believes it will not do anything that the president did not call for; it is not serving Nigerians but the president and the president is very slow. He probably forgot the kind of support he gained when he came into office. I think there is no sincerity in all that; the people are not sincere about it.

Is the security situation in Nigeria irreversible?

It is not irreversible; it is quite reversible provided we wake up and do the right thing. Why not mobilize our youths to come and deal with these vagabonds in the forest? How many are they? I know some are getting support from foreign bodies or so, but this is our country. If we like, we can surround these forests with human beings holding guns but our (security forces) only encounter these people when they attack them ( security personnel); and when you are able to get free from them, they run away. That is what has been happening all these years; there is no real confrontation, no real invasion. The initiative is always with the criminals.

This situation is gradually snowballing into attacks on police headquarters, correctional centres and other security formations, including killings of security personnel. What is your take on the growing instability across Nigeria?

It is time; presidential and other elections are drawing near, and people want any advantage that will advance their causes and interests. Definitely, the Igbo are raising up the issue of Biafra now in order to coerce Nigerians into having a president of Igbo extraction . It (the instability) is not genuine, it’s the purely political. The nation fought a civil war for three years and at the end, there was settlement or truce. Now, what is the point of somebody who was not even born during the war to come and start this kind of thing and people are listening to him?

What is happening is a plan towards 2023; that is the unfortunate part of it.

President Umar Musa Yar’adua was faced with similar agitations that almost crippled the nation’s oil industry, but he came up with an amnesty programme that checked the situation. Why is it difficult to President Buhari to come up such an initiative?

A wise leader will know when something is bad. Umar Musa Yar’adua saw that the principle of no negotiation with militants which they sometimes call criminals or murderers could be sacrificed in the face of stronger expediency. That is exactly what Yar’adua did. If I were him, I would do the same thing, instead of doing the sort of thing that Governor el-Rufai of Kaduna State is doing.

El- Rufai says he will keep to the principle of no negotiation with bandits, but it is not wise when human lives are at stake. At the time, he was saying he would never negotiate with criminals, about 39 lives were at stake. It’s time for him to sacrifice all these superior principles and dogmatism, you know, in favour of saving the lives of the abductees and then probably bring about lasting place eventually.

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Will you stretch that line of thought in support of Sheikh Gumi’s suggestion that Federal Governement should negotiate with bandits?

You see, it is not necessary that government should negotiate directly with the bandits; there are so many ways of doing it. It is not necessary that the governor and the leaders of the bandits should sit down at the negotiating table. No! Government has so many methods to adopt.

The Niger State governor has disclosed that the Boko Haram sect has hoisted its flag in Shiroro Local Government Area of the state, which is barely a two-hour drive to Abuja. What is your reaction to this?

Maybe the terrorists or insurgents or whatever you call them may take over Nigeria and under the nose of the Federal Government. I don’t have any idea on this.

The controversy over Minister of Communication’s alleged sympathy for the Taliban and Al-Qaeda in his sermons in the past is still blowing in the air. What do you make of calls for him to resign or be sacked?

I thought the President would appoint a neutral committee to investigate the issue so that whatever decision he takes will not boomerang on him as Mr. President, or as a leader, but as a result of a recommendation of a committee that carefully examined the issues involved and made recommendations to him. But he still remains adamant as if he is not even hearing what people are saying. I think that is not a wise step in democracy. He should do something. If people are linking this issue with terrorism, he should do something about it. If the government is sincere, there are so many means at its disposal.

A few Nigerians have started calling for President’s impeachment. As an elder statesman, what is your perception on the growing calls for the National Assembly to move against him and what are the implications?

I don’t want anything that will bring about an outcome that we don’t know. I think the President needs some pressure to live up to his responsibilities and face these issues as he should. If he gets the support of the National Assembly, people will know, and if the National Assembly is not giving him the necessary support, people will know. There is nothing to fear. I don’t see anything that will rock the boat to the existent that it will capsize and bring about loss of lives and so on and so forth. I think, as somebody who believes in dialogue, settlement and compromise, there should be a way of thrashing out this issue without resorting to things like impeachment. Who are those going to impeach the president? They are not honest. Who will believe them; look at the amount of salaries and allowances they are getting under the eyes of Nigerians who are struggling to earn N18,000 to N30,000 per month.

Many state governments can’t even pay the N30,000 minimum wage, are you aware of this?

Some states? They are not paying? It’s not that they can’t afford to pay it, but they are not paying, and nobody is talking to them -neither the National Assembly nor the Presidency. It is unfortunate.